Antibiotics

[mganstin]

I have no way to back up this suspicion and this may not be true for every case but I just have this feeling that antibiotics may be the culprit.

I have had several doctors tell me that antibiotics can do so much damage to our bodies that both they and us may not even know about yet in medicine. As a child I was on a whole host of antibiotics for various different things such as chronic ear infections, respiratory infections, yeast and bacterial infections, as well as many others.

In my case I have been told that antibiotics has most likely burned the lining of my intestines as well as other sensitive areas and has made my body sensitive to acidic foods and gluten ...and I truly believe this is why I got IC. Those "damaged" areas may affect the bladder area and cause a chronic discomfort.

This is just a hunch but I feel that antibiotics can certainly play a role in IC. If anyone has any other feelings on this or has reasons to believe that antibiotics are not related please feel free to post.

Meghan, IN

[humpieumpumkin]

Macrodantin makes me flare. I know call me crazy, I have heard it once from my old uro.:cussing: It causes burning in me for some reason. Antibiotocis are strong drugs!

Erika:hi:

[Nancypt]

Hi,
I have heard its good to take probiotics either in yogurt or pill form when you have to take antibiotics. Not sure how this affects IC though.
Nancy

[mganstin]

I definately get a flare when I take antibiotics....it feels like an inferno in there.

The majority of the antibiotics I've taken was in pill form.

I mostly had amoxacillin, bactrim, flagyl, and macrobid.

[verdicries]

:cussing: omg i'm on macrobid (one of the few, i hope, drugs i can take) rite now for a MONTH...i've only taken 1 PILL but have been flaring like crazy. HELP! i can't take ANYTHING (see sig for allergies...yikes) so i'm afraid to stop taking the macro, but geez.

:cussing:

[jen74]

I agree that antibiotics can cause a ton of damage to the body. I believe that is what caused my stomach motility issues as they started after I was on the anti-B augmentin.
It may be what caused my IC or it may not be, who knows really. It is funny because everyone is so different. I have a friend who has IC and she takes macrodantin daily and it is a god send for her. It keeps her IC in check along with other meds she is on. So I guess it just really depends.
Jen

[skrix]

I read about the antibiotics causing flares last night and it finally explained to me that I wasn't crazy.:loco:

Three months ago I had a pap and the results came back that I had a bacterial infection and they prescribed flagyl. I was down for a week with buring pain in my bladder.:help: I kept telling my family that I thought that it was the infection and once the antibiotic kicked in I would feel better. I did feel better once I completed the 7 days of antibiotics.

Last Tuesday I had a pelvic exam and diagnosed with yet another bacterial infection and again prescribed flagyl and I have been down again for another week. When I read the stories last night, I realized it wasn't so much the infection that was causing so much pain as it was the medication.

Thanks so much for sharing those stories.:angel: At least now I know and can ask for something else to try should another infection occur.

[NicoleB]

i've had tons of UTIs and the ONE time i took cipro, i got IC. i'll never know if there was a connection, but i hated that drug. it made me so nauseous (and i have a strong stomach) and after that UTI treated with Cipro, I've had pain ever since. Also, a few months before that, i had a terrible tonsil infection that too SIX bottles of antibiotics to clear up! AND i had broken up with my boyfriend of 7 years and was under tons of stress. 2006 was a bad year!

[katiemae13]

I have always suspected that my IC started after taking cipro for 2 UTIs. In the past, I had always taken macrobid for UTIs with no problems. When I took cipro for the (confirmed by culture) UTIs my symptoms did not get better in the first day like they normally do. In fact, they got worse over the course of antibiotics. When I went back to the doctor to tell them I still felt bad, they said my infection was gone and didn't seem to know what to tell me about me feeling worse. Ever since taking the cipro, I have had bladder/urethra pain on and off with no infection, and was finally diagnosed with IC. Whenever I have a UTI now, I ask for macrobid and my symptoms go away as expected in the first day.

My theory is that the cipro killed some good bacteria that were somehow preventing bladder problems.

[Gingerlily1]

I'm just the opposite. I feel much better after I've been on antibiotics (Levaquin) and my IC symptoms will usually go into remission for a while. I think, though, that my IC is caused by a chronic low-grade infection.

I suspect there are multiple causes of IC and antibiotics might be the cause for some people and not others.

I had a HORRIBLE flare when I took probiotics and did not realize what was causing the flare. A fellow ICer suggested it was the probiotics, and she was right--I felt so much better when I stopped them.

It's all very puzzling, isn't it?!

[IheartNursing]

Although Antibiotics kill the friendly flora in our bodies, they do not inflame or damage tissue or lining, so antibiotics can't really be the culprit of IC. However:

I have noticed bladder burning when taking antibiotics, and this is because of bladder yeast infections. I can't understand how a probiotic would flare you. That's strange. What type of probiotic were you taking?

I have extremely, extremely mild IC, so much that I only have flares every couple months or so and last no longer than 2-3 hours. But because I have IC and inflammation is a precursor to that I take a low-dose of Bactrim every night before bed, along with a regime of 15 billion probiotics daily to prevent any UTIs. I think a lot of your issues aren't necessarily the antibiotics but yeast in the bladder. What I thought were recurrent UTIs were actually a systemic yeast infection that I didn't even know I had! It was from taking tons and tons of antibiotics for these supposed UTI's but I was just harvesting more and more yeast. Lol.

If you have an issue with probiotics try taking garlic pills or other things that limit your yeast. I know a lot of people who have had REALLY bad IC and have been able to clear it up on a regime of low-dose antibiotics and acidphilus pills.

[Gingerlily1]

Although Antibiotics kill the friendly flora in our bodies, they do not inflame or damage tissue or lining, so antibiotics can't really be the culprit of IC. However:

I have noticed bladder burning when taking antibiotics, and this is because of bladder yeast infections. I can't understand how a probiotic would flare you. That's strange. What type of probiotic were you taking?

I have extremely, extremely mild IC, so much that I only have flares every couple months or so and last no longer than 2-3 hours. But because I have IC and inflammation is a precursor to that I take a low-dose of Bactrim every night before bed, along with a regime of 15 billion probiotics daily to prevent any UTIs. I think a lot of your issues aren't necessarily the antibiotics but yeast in the bladder. What I thought were recurrent UTIs were actually a systemic yeast infection that I didn't even know I had! It was from taking tons and tons of antibiotics for these supposed UTI's but I was just harvesting more and more yeast. Lol.

If you have an issue with probiotics try taking garlic pills or other things that limit your yeast. I know a lot of people who have had REALLY bad IC and have been able to clear it up on a regime of low-dose antibiotics and acidphilus pills.

Antibiotics have many side effects--for instance, Cipro CAN cause tissue damage. I had all-over musculoskeletal pain as a side effect to Cipro (and it is known that quinolones, expecially Cipro, can cause tendon rupture). Obviously tendon tissue is not the same as bladder tissue, but you can't assume that antibiotics don't cause damage or inflammation.

And remember, many drug side effects are NOT discovered during clinical trials and are instead discovered after thousands of people have taken the meds over a period of years. So the blanket statement that antibiotics " do not inflame or damage tissue or lining, so antibiotics can't really be the culprit of IC" may not be accurate.

I was taking acidophilus, and my acquaintance with IC pointed out that it is acidic, which just hadn't occured to me! :rolleyes: Many people with IC find that acidic foods/drink cause bladder irritation, so it's not that surprising that the acidophilus caused a flare, it just didn't occur to me that it might be a problem.

[IheartNursing]

Let me rephrase that: Antibiotics do not normally cause inflammation. Cipro itself is a BAD drug for side effects, probably more so than any other antibiotic. They had used it to treat anthrax patients, who later had worse symptoms than anthrax poisoning due to cipro. I remember being perscribed Cipro for a UTI and refused to take it.

I didn't mean to come off as a know-it-all, I just wanted to relay that antibiotics shouldn't be damaging tissues unless something else is going on there. It could be a correlation between the antibiotics and something else.

[jen74]

Unfortunately, ALL antibitoics can cause serious health issues, and they ALL destroy good bacteria as well. That is why it is so important to take acidophilis when having to take anti-B's of any kind.
Also, never take anti-B's unless you have a documented infection. The more anti-B's you take, the more chance you will become immune to them as well as possibly develop an allergy to them and not be able to take them again ( this happened to me),my allergist told me that many people develop allergies to antibitoics after taking them a few times only. Your body ends up developing antibodies against the drug and when you take it again, you may have a allergic reaction.
Anti-B's are good and have helped alot of people when they needed them, but I really think doctors now are to quick to hand them out. That is what is messing people up. I took amoxicillin 5 years ago for a severe throat infection and also augmentin, well after that my stomach has never worked right since and I have awful digestive motility issues. I even know people who are on a feeding tube now because of what antibitoics did to them and their digestive tract. It is pretty scary, and the doctors dont tell you these things could happen.
Jen

[Gingerlily1]

[QUOTE=jen74;350726]Unfortunately,
Also, never take anti-B's unless you have a documented infection.

Just wanted to comment. One of the reasons I developed IC (I believe) is because I had repeated and ongoing UTIs that NEVER, EVER cultured out anything. I would have blood in my urine, but no bacteria or white blood cells. My ignorant primary care doctor treated me like a hypochondriac until I ended up with kidney stones and was sent to a urologist, who told me I CLEARLY had signs of chronic infections in my bladder. :mad:

There are many doctors who think that ONE possible cause of IC/prostatitis is chronic, subclinical infections. I certainly agree that this was true in my case (although I would not call my infections "subclinical" because some clinical signs were there--low grade fever, bladder & urethral spasms, blood in urine--just no results with urine culture).

[jen74]

Hi Gingerlily,
Wow, I do also think that IC is possibly bacteria related as well, But I personally think that we have a defect in our bladders to begin with that make it suseptible to infections( the bacteria are able to stick to the bladder easily in our bladders, where in a normal bladder, it is able to rid the bacteria easily.)
I also do not agree with the fact that there has to be over 100,000 counts of bacteria for there to be a real infection. ANY amount of bacteria in any bladder is abnormal in my opinion. Also, most women with normal haelthy bladders, well when they get a infection, they usually dont have symptoms until there is over the 100,000 bacteria, where a person with IC will have symptoms right away when only very little bacteria is present. The doctors should realize this, but alot do not.
As far as the antibitoics, I just say that people should be cautious when taking them, especailly taking them often. I learned the hard way. I had a real bad year in 2003, and had taken antibitoics alot that year. Well, because of that, my stomach and whole digestive system got sooooooo screwed up, and still is today, I now have a neuropathic dysmotility of my small intestine which causes severe bloating, nausea, PAIN, and slow motility. ALL becuase of antibiotics. I have a few friends who got so sick from antibitoics that they are on feeding tubes because they have severe gastroparesis, which CAN be caused by overuse of antibitoics. Pretty scary huh?
I now try to do as much natural stuff as I can before I take antibitoics. I take probitoics everyday now, and I also take Dmannose and herbal teas to help prevent UTIs. Because I took abtibitoics alot in the past, I am now allergic to most of them. The body builds antibodies against them eventually and you wont be able to tolerate them. For me it is scary becuase, I my fear is that I will get sick a need an antibiotic and wont be able to take it due to all my allergies, and not to mention what other damage they do. That is why I do my best to stay infection free. I know we all get sick from time to time and will need antibitoics at some point though, this is life.
Anyhow, I have gabbed eough:). Hope you are feeling well.
Jen

[Vampireness]

This is really scary.....on feeding tubes....because of antibiotics :-|...woah.
I hate antibiotics but I have to be on them, since I get multiple infections, but I want to get off them asap, I wish I didn't need it.

I have a question about D-Mannose, no one is answering it.....
Does it only work on E.Coli bacteria? I tried this product several years ago and it didn't work at all...I felt no difference.....

Is there a way to prevent damage to the stomach?

[Briza]

Hi V
I've seen quite a few people here taking d-mannose recently and have been meaning to do some research on it. At this point, I know nothing at all about it, sorry!

Are you still taking your probiotics? A good refrigerated kind? That might be helpful in keeping your digestive tract well while you're having to take so many antibiotics, but I'm sure you probably are aware of that already!

And I'm sorry I haven't emailed yet, yes, I know I'm very very late in responding:(. But nothing is new, I've been home sick all week with fever and upper respiratory infection and earache, so my life has been extremely boring and I can't think of anything to write! :lmao: I'm sure things will get more interesting once I'm back to work! Talk to you soon:)

[Vampireness]

Hey Briza,

Respiratory Infection....damn I'm sorry.....Are you taking anything for it? Hope you start to feel better.

That website you sent me, it was pretty useful, I've been wanting to give D-Mannose another try, so I guess I'll give a three month period this time.

See, long ago, before I came across this site, like...hmm let's see.....three months after getting this illness I guess, I was positive for E.Coli bacteria, but of course I didn't know much about this at that time and I saw D-Mannose and I was like, I should try it and order a bottle and took it as directed, I felt no different......

So I thought this product is a fake....
Up till this day, I don't really get it.....my previous reports were E.Coli, I've stopped getting that and now have mixed bacteria, I have a wonderful cocktail of bacteria in my bladder, great, lucky me. lol

Again, a summary of the bacteria I've had:
E.Coli 12th May 2005, ?? Found At: Local Lab (This was found twice, can't remember the second date)
Staph Coagulase Negat 30th August 2006 Found At: United Medical Lab
Acinetobacter baumannii 30th August 2006 Found At: United Medical Lab
Klebsiella Pneumonaie 13th April/2006,4th July 2006, August 2007 Found At: Local & United Medical Lab
Strep B - ?? 2007 Found At: United Medical Lab

Of course, I have a report here that says "Mixed Bacteria Growth" "Viable count <<50,000 CFU/ML" So my doctor, told me I have no infection and asked me to go home.....

I hate staying on antibiotics, I've been loosing appetite quite abit and other times I feel really hungry and I feel really weak. And, my stomach hurts, but not that bad....blah..

I will be off Bactrim, in a couple days, WOOT! I was taking it for Klebsiella...

But, yes I'm taking probiotics, and increased probiotic intake to 36 billion CFU and I'm trying to get other strains as well, and thinking of purchasing Femdophilus.

Ahhh....so many products so little money...blah....
What an expensive illness...

I'll await your email! Feel better soon :)

[Vampireness]

To the person who started this thread:

I came across an article or more like a Nauropath mentioning that antibiotics destroy something in the bladder, can't recall what it is...muscous membranes I think?

We all know prolonged used of Antibiotics, is not good for our body but what other solution does one have to removed bacteria, especially when it's mixed bacteria. If a natural source was found, then awesome!

Over here, they dispense antibiotics, when you have a fever or cough or whatever, it's mostly amoxycillin, so I have developed a pretty good resistance to it. But, when ya really need it, like urine infection, they don't prescribe it for you....oookkk

Same goes for acne, I was given a full box of Doxycilline, couple years back while I still had this problem, but I took two or three pills and was like, "I don't want to take antibiotics for acne....." and so I stopped....and I refuse to take, though I'm offered...(except if my urine culture turns out with a sensitivity and I'm offered the very drug, it'll benefit me).

Nitrofurantoin (Macrobid) that names scares me!!!

[Briza]

Oops, sorry Donna, I didn't realize it was an ad. Will be more careful next time. Thanks for the reminder.

[jen74]

Did they find all these bacteria's in your bladder during one culture? I know most doctors say you have to have over 100,000 counts of bacteria for it to be considered a real infection, but that is bull! I had a UTI back in March. WHen I had the culture done it came back showing only 10,000 counts of bacteria and my gyne said that they usually only treat when it is 100,000 and over otherwise it is considered contaminated. She however h
gave me a script for the anti-B's and left it up to me. I decided to wait since I had an appointment with my urogyne two days later. Well I had another culture done and this time it showed A lot of bacteria so I had to take the anti-B's.
Some doctors just do not use their heads, honestly. I mean the urogyne I see now is very nice and very knowledgable, but we do not see eye to eye on everything. He also believes a low count bacteria is only contamination. He insists on having the urine cathererized in order to make sure there is no contamination. Here is the thing, a person with IC will feel ALOT of symptoms when there is only a very small amount of bacteria, where a normal person would not feel it until it is way advanced(over 100,000 counts of bacteria). SO in my opinion, you can have an infection and only have a small amount of bacteria, we just get the symptoms quicker before the bacteria can bulid so high.
As far as the anti-b's, it really scares me because I am allergic to almost all of them. I cannot take pennicillin, erythromycin, and just recently I have had reactions to cipro, and bactrim. So I have no clue what I would even take if I got an infection even. I have taken macrobid, but it upset my stomach, so I just dont know. You think they would have a wider variety of classes of anti-B's since there are alot of people with allergic reactions. I mean of you are allergic to pennicillin, then you cannot take anything in that family, or if you are allergic to cipro, then you cannot take any other quninolones anti-B's in that same family. It leaves you with little else to take.
Anyhow, I hope you are feeling better. Oh, I also had the
strep B in my urine at one time, my doctor said they only treat pregnant women who have this, otherwise they say it is harmless and that alot of women have this in their urine. At least that is what I was told. ALso the only anti-B to treat this is , you guessed it, pennicillin , which I cannot take :(
Hope you feel better soon.
Jen

[Vampireness]

Jen - I stated the days/year/month, I took the culture.....so some bacteria were found together.

I agree with you on this: "you can have an infection and only have a small amount of bacteria, we just get the symptoms quicker before the bacteria can bulid so high."

I'm not going to say IC patients feel it sooner because there is a whole debate about IC and it's bacteria related. So, I'm going to say, those who have little bacteria and display symptoms, should be treated.

I was told to insert the probiotic for the Strep B, but I don't know how to insert...it's a gross procedure....There is a gel applicator?? Martha, please explain this.

Yeah, I know they say it's harmless (Group B Strep), but you want to be completely infection free and you want cultures showing no bacteria, before you say, antibiotics don't work for me or I have IC and not recurrent/chronic UTIs. So, I think treating every bacteria in any number is a must.

United does urine cultures and broth cultures. My urine culture showed no infection but that's when broth culture showed Staph and Acinetobacter baumannii. This is why, the several number of times, I went to the doctor and they said, I don't have anything.

Plus, one of the Urogynaecologist told me, that sometimes even when you're treated with antibiotics, the bacteria gets into the bladder lining and it doesn't die off with the regular course, so long term antibiotic is needed.

I also read, that E.Coli mulitplies every twenty minutes, double it's colony...damn that is scary and also though it's dead, it can still bother the bladder when in the lining.

And, to think I have an infection last year, for three months at one time, till I went to get antibiotics. I was so tired of results showing negative so the longer you wait and the more they multiply, up till more than 100,000CFU, then it's considered an infection and then I get antibiotics, which was ridiculous. I stayed longer than that before, when I was told, nothing could be done for me and I don't have any infections and they don't know what's wrong so I just tried to live my life, this way....and I don't know, maybe six months passed or four months, till I couldn't take it and went to see the doctor and they found E.Coli.

It's so frustrating to wait for bacteria to form a parade in your bladder FIRST, then you get treatment. *shakes head*

[Mamat]

I have read what all you have to say. Have had IC for just over a year and still trying to figure it all out. I am facing double knee surgery this summer while out of school. When I go to the doctor I want to be able to tell him about the battle with IC and discuss what antibiotics. You know I am dreading flares that might be caused by the stress, the medication etc from the surgery, more than the surgery itself. If any of you can advise along these lines I would be so thankful. Is there a list of possibilities for reactions to ant-Bs like the list of possible food probs?

[ICNDonna]

Mamat, this is a very old thread; I reposted your inquiry so you should get some responses.

Because this thread is old I will be closing it.

Donna